Archived Message
Potentially the end of modified cars
This affects everyone with an interest in cars. If this goes through then in 6 weeks’ time all modified cars are effectively illegal. You can forget about the current 8 point system too. This is an EU directive that effectively supersedes what we have now! That's everything from the young guy with a stainless exhaust on his/her saxo, through to hot-rods, via pro touring cars, via modified classics, veedub scene... you name it we are ALL affected. Even modern cars with different alloys will become embroiled. There will be more info soon from the ACE about what we can do, but for now just spread the word. We need to make our voices heard that this is NOT acceptable. This is the UK, we don't need or want to be told what to do by Brussels.
Jon Moulds
22/08/2012 @  00:17
Under topic: General
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Potentially the end of modified cars
This news item came from a report on the Octane magazine website on 31st July 2012 and was posted on the V8 Website as a NEWS item some two weeks ago noting Chris Hunt Cooke had said "the FBHVC is on the case - the Chairman of the Legislation Committee David Hurley has already said that it is important to get this proposal changed before it gets any further through the EU process. In the EU it is important to influence proposals at an early stage when people are open to suggestions, later on things develop their own momentum and changes become more difficult. If it was left until it was in the process of being incorporated in UK legislation it would be too late to change any fundamentals. Influencing legislation at any early stage is one of the most important functions of the FBHVC. We have this on the agenda for our Legislation Committee meeting next Wednesday, and we shall decide how we can best tackle this."

The FBHVC is an effective and influential body representing British historic and classic car clubs. I have spoken with Chris this morning and, although he is tied up today, he will post a balanced and well informed report on the current situation and prospects for this EU measure later today.
V8 Webmaster
22/08/2012 @  16:45
Potentially the end of modified cars
Don't panic Mister Mainwearing!!!!!!!!!
I am afraid that that this is alarmist nonsense from ACE written by someone who does not know how the EU works. This is simply the first draft of a proposed directive, issued for comment. The DfT have circulated a paper picking out some of the items and requested the reactions of a few organisations. They are not set up at this stage to receive individual comments, and flooding them with individual comments will not be in the least helpful.

What the Commission have done is more or less take the German model of testing, where one of the criteria is whether the vehicle conforms to the original type approval, and what FBHVC will be doing is urging that the UK model is maintained, under which the vehicle as presented is tested for safety related items. The proposal as drafted is wholly impracticable in any event, requiring detailed specifications of every vehicle ever built to be available to the tester, in order to determine whether it has been modified, because a modified vehicle could not be a historic vehicle and therefore exempt, whatever its age.

Has anyone ever heard of ACE before? It seems to me that they may be trying to get themselves known by creating a panic about "Armageddon". That is rather what a certain classic car publication is famous for, scare headlines to attract buyers.
Chris Hunt Cooke
22/08/2012 @  16:55
Potentially the end of modified cars
ACE = Auto Club Europa
in other words a car club like the AA, RAC or ADAC. This announcement is clearly without any base and is journalistic and in no way law.
Peter Garton
22/08/2012 @  18:02
Potentially the end of modified cars
Putting aside the 'ACE' comments, obviously subtle mods to original spec would be very difficult to identify by your average MOT tester or indeed by any legislation as impractical for various reasons. However, an MGB V8 is clearly NOT to original spec and not very difficult to spot ! So how would such cars be regarded? Or indeed kit cars as there is NO original spec to be compared against? Unless the original SVA test is regarded as the 'original spec' and subsequent MOTs are checked against that SVA spec? Hopefully, the mud will clear in time.
Pat Boghossian
22/08/2012 @  18:26
Potentially the end of modified cars
Peter, in this instance ACE means Association of Car Enthusiasts, as John Moulds indicated with the link given in his post. Follow that link and you will see the cars that their group are involved with.

Chris, I am very happy that we have your cool head on the case and look forward to hearing the facts as and when David Hurley has something concrete to tell you and us. Until then we should all keep a clear head and carry on . . . something like that anyway.
Angus Munro
22/08/2012 @  19:04
Potentially the end of modified cars
Thank you Angus. My error as I didn't get into the link Jon mentioned but I'll do just that!
Peter Garton
22/08/2012 @  19:33
Potentially the end of modified cars
I looked into the link which was very detailed indeed. The Germans are deeply involved in this it seems to me.
The DEKRA (Deutsches Kraftfahrzeug Überwachungs-Verein) and TÜV (Technischer Überwachungs-Verein) are quoted early on in the proposal and thus it is clear that the German form of 2 year testing is being used as a foundation for this law of unifying the technical testing of all vehicles. Both these organisiations are authorised to test vehicles either in their own centres or in the case of DEKRA in one's own vehicle work shop. The text proposals are sometimes fairly vague and it is probably virtually impossible to focus on this sort of thing internationally, meaning that each "member" has absolutely indentical/universal testing parameters.
Peter Garton
22/08/2012 @  19:59
Potentially the end of modified cars
Yes, by all means let's keep calm and carry on. Meanwhile let's get out of Europe.
Terry Starkey
23/08/2012 @  06:03
Potentially the end of modified cars
Some media commentary on this topic circulating as though there is a bout of "galloping gut" sweeping the twitterati has tended towards the Private Frazer "we're all doomed" end of the scale. It's certainly a serious issue and the FBHVC is treating it accordingly, so today has issued a press release with a measured and authoritative report on the current situation.
V8 Webmaster
23/08/2012 @  21:43
Potentially the end of modified cars
Given that there are people at ACE who have been working with the government since the 70's I'm fairly certain they do understand how EU law works. Effectively they have circumvented the consultation process by using snippets that have already gone through this process already. it only needs reading in the EU parliament twice before it becomes law unless a member state objects. Well done to the ACE for getting it out there and in the spotlight. Better that than the head in the sand mentality that so many so called "enthusiasts" demonstrate.
Jon Moulds
23/08/2012 @  22:36
Potentially the end of modified cars
The recent posting above included a lengthy statement from Nigel Farage’s office that was clearly political. We do not want the V8BB to become a political debating forum so that item has been removed. A number of members have been in touch to say they do not feel that is what they want to see. So until we have definitive and authoritative information on the progress of the consideration of the EU proposals from people who are well informed through a participating role or a direct involvement, this thread is closed.
V8 Webmaster
24/08/2012 @  03:09
Potentially the end of modified cars
Well we shall see in six weeks time, will it be the end of civilisation as we know it, or will this proposal be grinding its way slowly through the EU process, being changed into something more sensible and acceptable along the way? The DfT circular mentioned that "Discussions on these proposals at EU level will commence in early September".
Chris Hunt Cooke
24/08/2012 @  03:15
This thread is closed
No further postings on this thread or on matters related to the EU vehicle testing proposals topic will be accepted on the V8BB.
V8 Webmaster
25/08/2012 @  04:42
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